MTB 74 and the St. Nazaire Raid MTB built

The “brilliant success” of “the greatest raid ever” claimed in many English language books shows that many writers do research limited to English language sources. The Kriegstagebücher are rarely read. Some even claim not to know the number of U-Boote. A trip to German archives and….. .

Same with troop numbers. Some count 6.000 Germans, simply including all in the wider area around town.. There was not a single Heer infantrymen in the fight at the docks or bunker Only in mopping up in town later did they come into play.
The Commandoes failed in the mission against the submarines, beaten by the men from 16. Minensucherflotille. Commandoes got defeated in land combat by sailors from Trawler type Minesweepers.. They destroyed two tugs and two small tankers used in harbor, and a Hafenschutzboot was sank by own crew. They also destroyed the pumps of old gate. They blew up some stores but the Germans collected more than 5 tons of not exploded British explosives.

Worse, failing to attack and destroy the new/southern entrance the operations of the two submarine flotillas got not disturbed. The damaged old one was rarely used by the Kriegsmarine before the raid.

The Kriegsmarine had abandoned the hope of successful use of battleships in Atlantic post loss of Bismarck. The many attacks by British bombers had made the Atlantic coast an unhealthy area for the big ships. The Channel breakthrough should have made clear to RN that the dock had lost the strategic importance.

To get Normandie dock and old harbor exit gates out of order was a success. But the modern Southern gate made that futile. St. Nazaire stayed operational as submarine base. Many brave men died for a propaganda victory.

Absolutely true. I stated the destruction as success.

But……

The Germans could not understand that the southern gate was left intact. The U-Boote being a main target of the raid!
With that gate the Harbor was fully operational.

War propaganda sold the raid as a superb success. That is naturally in wartime. But not in books post war.

Two U-Boot Flottillen operated from St, Nazaire, protected by bunkers against the RAF. How many ships could Tirpitz destroy in an Atlantic raid? And how many 20 U-Boote from a safe repair base at Atlantic?

The U-Boote had three possible ways out of St. Nazaire. Normandie Dock, Harbor gate and Southern gate. The last being the one most used by Kriegsmarine. To destroy 2 of 3 was a failure, not victory. A gate too far….;-)

Brave men died in that action. They deserve praise for their courage. But not those on green table.

You miss my point. The just three ways out of St. Nazaire Bassin.

Old harbor gate, new (Southern) gate and in emergency via the drydock. If all three would have been destroyed the subs in bassin would have been captured. For a long time.

Not chasing them in Atlantic.

The Harbor gate pumps got destroyed by Commandoes. It was near the dock. They could have done more, they had many explosive stores that they did not use. 5000 kg collected by the Germans later.

Why not try to use the special big explosives of MTB 74 in Southern gate? The main gate for KM?
Or even better, use a second ship there? No, they told the Commandoes to storm to the bunkers. A big planning mistake.

For Germans, like Befehlshaber Sicherung West Ruge, it was a miracle that the gate was not destroyed.

He was very satisfied with his men, reservists and young new sailors. Minimum crews, most men being absent in air shelters. Against elite Commandoes.

Imagin rules for that. No, nasty IO. Bad bad Boy.

My model gives many game options. The original Brest Operation, St. Nazaire as done and St. Nazaire as possible.

Sore loser? Come on.

Yes, they destroyed the main target. That would have been a trap for Tirpitz. Inter service rivalry blinded the admirals. Scharnhorst and Gneisenau had fled from Atlantic coast, RAF bombed.

They missed the chance to trap two submarine flottillas in their home. For a Long time, old harbor gate was never fully operable again in war. They had not much success in killing Submarines at home in Germany in 1942/43. Not like 44/45.

That Comandos see it as big success, sure. Like Arnhem for the Paras. Bravery celebrated. The more dead, the better. But bravery is no benchmark. Strategic effect counts. And sorry, that was minimal.

Hmm, the southern gate, there was something about guilty of failing to “do his utmost”…..

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You know the Granville raid 1945? To restore morale of channel Island garrison and obtain needed supplies. 100 tons of coal and Food. No superb succcess but they gained what they needed. Loosing one of 6 minesweepers (Run aground and scuttled). Also in force 3 armed barges. 3 motor launches, 1 tug.
Losses in men: 6 kia.

Nothing big but they had to use what they had. Without air cover.

I should apologize. Because it was a bait. I wanted to see the reaction.

To tell that a national memory treasure like St. Nazaire was a failure because it had no strategical effect is a ……. The commando men had order to destroy both gates. And died yards from southern gate. The bravest of Britain against German sailors from converted trawlers. Just bad luck. Even the best can die.

It was a test. I expected the fox and sour grape reaction. It was not destroyed because we did not wanted to….. .
Scharnhorst / Gneisenau / Prinz Eugen march through channel was no German victory. It was hardly a retreat, it was a flight. Since May 41 the ships lay there idle as RAF bomb targets. Light hits from time to time. Just a question of time until some RAF plane would hit better.

They sank around 22 merchantmen in the Atlantic. Running away from every big ship engagement. On order! More than 3.000 German sailors, enough for more than 30 U-Boote. What could 30 submarines do in comparison?

The OKM not even dared to send them via Atlantic raiding round UK to Norway. But even today some authors see it as German victory because they sailed in “English” channel.
It was that “humiliation” that should never happen again. But in fact a British victory.

Or the Bismarck mission. A big failure. Well, sinking a national treasure, the Hood. A lovely looking battlecruiser. The symbol of RN in the 20’s. But there was something wrong with the bloody battlecruiser design. A bad deal to sacrifice the modern Bismarck in a futile mission.

Would somebody expect Hitler to send Tirpitz on same mission? With the other big ships gone home? Offering the RN another German symbol to sink? Or to get damaged so much to need that dock in RAF range?

Could the admiralty really thought that as possibility in 1942? 1941 yes, before the Luftwaffe went away to Russia. But not post loss of Bismarck and flight of the others. Stupidity or recklessness? Well, I prefer a reckless staff to a stupid one. But both deserve blame.

The Commando men fought bravely at South gate. And deserve respect for that. But had bad luck. To state that is not putting dirt on them. It’s just making mortal men out of a myth.

Is a futile victory a victory? Like that of the Rangers at Pointe du Hoc. That won the objective. Taking a gun emplacement without guns. Not one of the French 155 mm guns was operational. 2/HKAA.1260 was no longer part of coastal defense. Not the fault of the brave men that died.

Today’s elite forces have a habit to make myths from hard fights. From Legion in Mexico Cameron to modern times. But bravery should never become an end in itself.