Units on transport

[Master Chief]

Wow, there are rules hidden all over the place 😂 So no Pen for the D6 hits that passengers take for a vehicle being destroyed 👍

[Nat]

@stuart – its in the massive damage rules… ok I’ve paraphrased it as I typed that from memory 🙁  how ever as I said in #179522 you cant have a rule that says roll 2 damage and apply both unles the 1st is destroyed and then have another one that says roll X damage and apply all of them because the X damage came from 2 separte weapons

Also – thanks for finding the no PEN for destroyed transports entry… knew I’d red it somewhere!! – have a like!

[Stuart Harrison]

Massive damage literally says you roll 2 dice and apply both.  Nothing is suggested about only applying the first if one of those results is ‘knocked out’.

Remember the ‘Shooting at Vehicles’ section isn’t a replacement to the normal shooting rules, it only mentions where the normal sequence varies for vehicles (ie: no mention of declaring targets as there is no difference when the target is a vehicle). All rolls in a given step are treated as simultaneous, even if we usually break them up for convenience.

Imagine you are rolling all ‘to damage’ dice simultaneously.

You have two successes, one from the faust (you get massive damage) and  one from the FT (you get a superficial)

That’s 3 rolls on the damage results table, one at a minus 3 modifier.  All three results would be rolled and applied simultaneously.

[Nat]

picture attached… cant quote page number as I’m looking at an ebook version… but it says roll once, apply then roll again (unless the vehicle is destroyed by the first result, of course)

Ok the same paragraph then goes on to look like its contradicting its self by saying roll two dice and apply both results……. hmm… where’s that fence!  I’m still going to play consequtive rolls on the damage table stopping when destroyed, however I wont force anyone to do it that way who wants to roll and apply all at once….

 

can we get some proof readers who play by RAW please Warlord! :p

 

 

• This reply was modified 4 years, 5 months ago by Nat.

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[Master Chief]

Haha I think you can still roll 2 dice and apply both results … one after the other, unless of course the first one destroys the vehicle. I do see Stuart’s point about applying all damage dice simultaneously instead of sequentially. But I have always thought all hits from a single firing unit on a single target will score only 1 pin regardless of number of hits from different weapons of the unit, or did I understand wrongly?

[Nat]

no you havent got wrong… its 1 pin per firing unit…. unless the firing unit has HE or a flamethrower in which case those pins will take precidence.

ie 5 rifles will be 1 pin

5 rifles and a rifle grenade will be D2 pins

5 rifles and a flamethrower will be D6+1 pins

 

[Stuart Harrison]

“But I have always thought all hits from a single firing unit on a single target will score only 1 pin regardless of number of hits from different weapons of the unit, or did I understand wrongly?”

The hits cause a single pin (or batch of pins) same as any other shooting situation, but the first three results on the damage results table each include “Add one additional pin marker to the vehicle”.  Multiples of those damage results are going to stack up pins.

[Steeljackal]

🤦‍♂️😅 Another badly written part of the rulebook… No Pen value to roll to damage…

at first reading the regulation seems simple, but then you go into detail and the rulebook is written very badly, many things are unclear or clearly written wrong, and then the FAQs say otherwise

[Greg S]

So to boil it down a little, if one infantry unit fires two fausts at a transport and scores 1 damage roll and one massive damage roll, then rolls 1,1,4; do they inflict:

A) 1 pin for hitting and destroy the transport, forcing the transported unit to dismount with 1 pin; or

B) 1 pin fit hitting, 2 extra for 2 x crew stunned and destroy the vehicle, forcing a dismount with 3 pins?

I’m inclined to think B, three pins.  If I expend 2 fausts, rolls two hits and two pens, I want spectacular results. 🙂

 

[Nat]

Yes  is would be option B….. if you rolled 4,1,1, then it could be B or A (depending on how you read the massive damage paragraph!).   If you rolled a 1 for the pen hit & then a 4 +1  it would be forced disembarked with 2 PINs

[Nick]

And I thought this was a simple couple questions. To bad there aren’t any tournaments to drive judges crazy .  Anyway till more definitive answer comes along we’ll   house rule this one.

Thanks to everyone for input.

[Steeljackal]

I always say that the rule book is poorly written. Bolt Action is a nice regulation but poorly written.

I had written an email to Warlord for a confirmation on the roll to damage units on board following the destruction of the vehicle.

They tell me that the rule team has not spoken at the moment but has only said that in the next FAQ there will be clarification 😅 yet another clarification.
Yet it was easy to write a sentence unequivocally in rulebook.

Who replied to the email says that in the meantime not to consider the penetration value, but let’s see what will come out in the next FAQ.

[Steeljackal]

EDIT

I don’t know what happen, this reply was a copy of an old reply

• This reply was modified 4 years, 2 months ago by Craig.
• This reply was modified 4 years, 2 months ago by Steeljackal.

[Stuart Harrison]

See the FAQ page for AoSU, body armour question.

“Does the body armour bonus apply against hits suffered in close
combat? And what about against hits from a destroyed transport the
engineers were riding in?
Yes to both, as most damage in close combat is caused by small
arms, and damage from burning transports does not have a Pen
value and thus counts as small arms fire.”

[Master Chief]

This was also recently just clarified in the latest FAQ Sep 2020:

If a transport vehicle is destroyed, transported unit suffer D6 hits. Do these hits use the PEN value of the weapon that hit and destroyed the vehicle?

No, the roll to damage is made without PEN modifiers.

[Author]

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